Style that’s forever

Don Letts with music producer and 99 Records founder Ed Bahlman on Singers & Players War of Words (99-002 LP) and Adrian Sherwood’s label: “I mean all the early On-U stuff is absolutely essential.”

In There And Black Again: The Autobiography Of Don Letts (Omnibus Press) we learn the fate of a screenplay (“inspired by Linton Kwesi Johnson’s Five Nights of Bleeding”) bought by the adventurous producer Michael White (Gracie Otto’s The Last Impresario) and its connection to Franco Rosso’s Babylon, co-written with Martin Stellman (Franc Roddam's Quadrophenia, Idris Elba's Yardie), starring Brinsley Forde, and a soundtrack put together by Dennis Bovell (The Slits Cut producer). Martin Scorsese, The Punk Rock Movie, Robert De Niro, The King of Comedy, Jerry Lewis, and The Clash shows at Bonds also have a link to Don Letts.

Music producer and 99 Records founder Ed Bahlman met Don Letts at The Roxy 45 years ago and was invited by Bernie Rhodes to The Clash rehearsal studio up at Chalk Farm Road where he met the original line-up of Joe Strummer, Mick Jones, Paul Simonon, and Terry Chimes. 99 Records’ ESG (four sisters from the South Bronx) is the only band to perform with The Clash at Bonds in 1981 and with Public Image Ltd at the Pasadena Convention Center in 1982. Keith Levene told Ed (ESG’s producer/live sound engineer/advisor) that ESG was the only group PiL came early to the venue for, to listen to the soundcheck during their US tour.

Don Letts with Anne-Katrin Titze: “Style, that’s forever.”

A bit of early history on The Clash and their first North American tour: At their shop 99 in New York City in 1978, Gina Franklyn and Ed Bahlman were asked to do the Give 'Em Enough Rope tour T-shirt based on the album cover artwork when CBS Records rejected The Clash idea of calling it the Pearl Harbor Tour. Caroline Coon who was now managing The Clash called Ed from Vancouver in 1979, stating let’s go with the original plan for the East Coast leg of the concerts, hence the official tour T-shirt was now the Pearl Harbor Tour, created by 99 with an image of Bo Diddley included, who was since confirmed to be on the bill.

A few years after The Clash shows at Bonds, Ed received a phone call asking him if he would be interested in working with Mick Jones on his new project. Ed told the caller to let Mick know that he could come by 99 to discuss what he had in mind. Mick never followed up because Ed didn’t make a commitment sight-unseen and his new project ended up becoming Big Audio Dynamite (B.A.D.) with Don Letts.

Is Don Letts in Vivienne Westwood for Rebel Dread?: “That’s the strangest question that anybody has asked me. [Letts thinks, claps his hands, then points at me] Yes! Yes it is!” Photo: Rebel Dread

Every chapter begins as if it were a screenplay in There and Black Again: The Autobiography of Don Letts with Mal Peachey. William E Badgley’s documentary Rebel Dread with Don Letts as our on-camera guide through the life and times of his creative fervour is the perfect companion piece, a kind of abridged audiobook version with film clips and remembrances from Mick Jones, Jeannette Lee, Paul Simonon, John Lydon, Vivien Goldman, Daddy G. (Massive Attack), Jazzie B. (Soul ll Soul), Dennis Bovell, Norman Jay (Good Times Sound System), The Roxy’s Chris Salewicz, Andi Oliver, Don’s wife Grace, and his brother Desmond Coy.

“Don is a catalyst for the minds & spirits of so many of us.” - Jim Jarmusch in Rebel Dread.

From London (at 11:19am, which is 6:19am NYC time in March 2022), Don Letts joined me and Ed Bahlman on Zoom for an in-depth conversation on Rebel Dread and his time in New York in the early Eighties. Ed and I spoke with Don before a review copy of his book arrived from the publisher in London.

Ed Bahlman remarks: “There And Black Again: The Autobiography Of Don Letts is more than a memoir, it is a comprehensive look at the world through the eyes of an artist who is fully engaged at all times. Don Letts is the real deal.”

Anne-Katrin Titze: Hi!

Don Letts: Anne-Katrin, can you hear me?

AKT: Perfectly. Good morning from New York City, the sun will be rising while we talk.

Don Letts: “New York was buzzing at that time ’81,’82, it was absolutely buzzing.” Photo: Lisa Jones

DL: Okay, I was wondering why it was dark outside your window. Now it all makes sense. I’m in West London, it’s nearly midday.

AKT: You are definitely more awake than I am. Originally I got your contact through Dennis Bovell whom I interviewed for Babylon in 2019. How does it feel for you to have a documentary like this made about you?

DL: Horrible. Listen, I’m used to talking about what I’m doing, not what I’ve done. Having to kind of reflect, it’s not a comfortable space for Don Letts. I like to be constantly moving forward. Having said that, between the book coming out - I had a book coming out last year called There And Black Again - and the film [Rebel Dread] coming out, they’ve given context to my life. And I guess I have to own that it hasn’t been bad. Does it justify a film? I don’t know. Only the viewers can tell me that.

AKT: It does. I’m a viewer, I can tell you that. Bill Badgley, whom I actually talked to about The Slits film [Here to Be Heard: The Story of the Slits] which led into this, he interviews your brother [Desmond Coy], who talks about your weight and people from all over your life. Was there anyone who surprised you the most in what they were saying about you?

DL: No, not really, because I own my shit, man. I tell you what, I realised these things are better made when the subject is dead. Because the interviewees can be really honest about what kind of dick that person occasionally was. Or could be all the time. The other funny thing about it is, it made me feel like I was dead. You know, all this talk about the past, it made me feel like I was dead. So that was all very weird for me. But other than that, no, nothing that anybody said bothered me. That comes with being 66, you can own it, man. You can own it all.

Don Letts and John Lydon with Vivien Goldman at Heathrow airport to catch a flight to Jamaica: “I think she came over to interview Peter Tosh.” Photo: Vic Crawshaw

AKT: Let’s talk about your style a little bit. Are you wearing Vivienne Westwood for the interview in the movie? The animal print shirt?

DL: That’s the strangest question that anybody has asked me. [Letts thinks, claps his hands, then points at me] Yes! Yes it is! Yes of course, that is a Vivienne Westwood top, yeah, yeah, yeah.

AKT: I thought I recognised her insignia. It’s a choice, what to wear for an interview.

DL: I can tell you this much, it definitely wasn’t brand placement.

AKT: In the film you talk about a big shift that happened with music for you. All your Beatles memorabilia had to go out at one point from one day to another. Did that happen to you style wise? Were there great sudden shifts in your style?

DL: You wouldn’t say the dude with the great afro, like a Michael Jackson afro, shifting to the Soul Boy with little curly dreadlocks this long - that all happened within four or five years. You’re making me sort of state the obvious, but listen, I’m Black British and that combination of music and fashion, we turned that shit into an art form, man. It was the only way for us to express ourselves, to have any kind of identity, to find our tribe. It was and still is a huge part. I still like to look good. It’s just in my DNA. I’m not talking about fashion, because fashion kind of comes and goes. What I’m talking about is style. Style, that’s forever.

AKT: That’s what I meant. Yes, I saw the shifts in the film, but also an underlying style that remained.

John Lydon with Don Letts: “I was friends with the Pistols and then me and John became extra close when he took me to Jamaica.” Photo: Don Letts

DL: Listen, if you got it [style], it ain’t something you talk about, man. That’s why I said it’s a strange question for you to ask because it starts taking away the magic when you’re talking about it, as if it’s some premeditated thing. You got it or you ain’t, man. It’s not something that you learn. I got to say this, style without content ain’t jack shit. You got to back it up with this [he points at his head]. Otherwise you’re just a clotheshorse.

AKT: It’s definitely organic. I have someone here who wants to say hello to you, Ed Bahlman of 99 Records.

DL: What is he doing up so early?

AKT: Waiting for the sunrise and for you!

DL: Good morning!

Ed Bahlman: Don, you look great!

DL: Could be a figment of your imagination this early in the morning.

EB: Maybe I’m still asleep. I really appreciated when you came over with The Slits and brought by mixed tapes to my shop 99. I was the only one who had Steel Leg v the Electric Dread.

DL: I’m sorry about that. That was an accident, that record. Anyway, that’s another story.

EB: How did you get involved with Keith with that?

DL: Oh man, obviously I was friends with the Pistols and then me and John became extra close when he took me to Jamaica. When he came back from Jamaica he started Public Image. Wobble and Levene were part of that. That Steel Leg thing came out of that kind of mélange of creativity. Not one of my finest moments I can tell you. It was never supposed to come out in the form that it did. If your readers want the full facts, tell them to check the movie or read my book.

There And Black Again: The Autobiography Of Don Letts with Mal Peachey (Omnibus Press) Photo: Anne-Katrin Titze

EB: In the photograph of you and John going to Jamaica, is that Vivien Goldman (Dirty Washing - 99 Records, 1981)?

DL: Yes, Vivien Goldman was there for a little while. I think she came over to interview Peter Tosh.

EB: Oh great. I also did the Singers & Players album on my label 99.

DL: Oh wow, I love that! On-U?

EB: Yeah absolutely, Adrian sent me all the cassettes of the recordings he was working on.

DL: He’s still highly productive. He puts out shit every week, every month, unbelievable.

EB: I noticed he was in The Slits film, which was a great get. He had said, “Ed, choose what you want!” And I chose the first Singers & Players, War of Words.

DL: I can’t remember the tracks, I got. I mean all the early On-U stuff is absolutely essential.

EB: Absolutely. I got Devious Woman placed in Susan Seidelman’s film Smithereens (1982).

DL: Oh really?

EB: Her first film, that showed in Cannes, that Richard Hell starred in. Anton from The Feelies told her to call me at the shop. She had two scenes without music and I said Devious Woman would work and ESG. Do you know ESG, do you remember them?

Don Letts on the On-U Sound Singers & Players War Of Words on 99 Records: “Oh wow, I love that!” Photo: Anne-Katrin Titze

DL: Hey dude, come on, I wouldn’t be Don Letts if I didn’t know Emerald, Sapphire, and Gold, come on!

EB: When they performed at Bonds, I did the sound for them.

Ed had all access credentials for The Clash shows at Bonds in 1981 where ESG (Moody 99-04 EP, 1981) and Bush Tetras (Too Many Creeps 99-02, 1980) were invited to perform. When The Clash shows expanded from eight to 17 due to the overselling of tickets, Bernie Rhodes, now back as manager of The Clash, called Ed requesting that ESG perform in at least three of the additional nine shows. ESG was not interested in doing so.

DL: I was at every single show, I filmed it, man, The Clash run at Bonds.

EB: The whole run?

DL: It’s legendary. In fact, I’m supposed to be putting something together with some of the footage I found. I found some and I’m trying to get the guys to help me put something out in a formal fashion.

EB: Great. Did you get Bush Tetras also, did you catch them?

DL: I haven’t got them on film but I knew those guys. I was living in New York from ’81 to ’82. You know, Bush Tetras, Ballistic Kisses, they were all part of that thing that was going on.

EB: Liquid Liquid?

DL: Liquid Liquid. I’m hip. Dude, I was living in Orchard Street and I was tucked into the kind of emerging graffiti writers and a gentleman called Peter Dougherty. I don’t know if you know Peter?

Rick Rubin and Ed Bahlman Def Jam first event with Liquid Liquid, Treacherous Three, Heart Attack in 1982 Photo: Ed Bahlman

EB: Yeah, of course, he was a regular [at 99].

DL: Peter was my conduit to everything that was happening in New York.

EB: Good conduit alright. I still have your mixed tapes that you gave me.

DL: Really? Damn! I used to make them for everybody; it was my way of creatively communicating with people.

EB: You were the most joyous person when you were around.

DL: Thank you. New York was buzzing at that time ’81,’82, it was absolutely buzzing. Like in London we had this punky reggae thing and in New York we had this punky hip-hop thing happening almost.

EB: We did the first Def Jam show with Rick Rubin. Liquid Liquid headlined at the Hotel Diplomat. We had Treacherous Three open and Heart Attack. We were doing our own punky reggae.

DL: It was hip-hop, punky hip-hop.

EB: I’ll let Anne-Katrin take over.

DL: Alright man!

Don Letts’s first video was for White Riot by The Clash Photo: Anne-Katrin Titze

EB: Great to see you, Don!

DL: Thank you!

AKT: I have just one last question. There is a moment in the film when John Lydon is setting fire to a Doris Lessing book. Is there a particular context?

DL: No, he’s not making any political or intellectual statement. He was just being Johnny Rotten as he was known back then.

AKT: Thank you so much, the sun is up now!

DL: Thank you, bye!