Lloyd Kaufman
When it comes to making independent films on next-to-nothing budgets, putting across strong political points and entertaining millions, there's nobody like Lloyd Kaufman. As head of Troma Entertainment he has developed his own very distinctive brand of high camp, gore, nudity, playful comedy and biting satire. Not many people would get me to brave the Edinburgh festival crowds, in which it can take ten minutes to walk ten metres, but to meet Lloyd it's well worth it.
We meet in a hotel room overlooking the Royal Mile, where he's relaxing on a polka dot sofa. His wife - the New York State film commissioner - is off somewhere exploring the Fringe; they've come over to present two of his films at an event organised by the Edinburgh B Team. I start by passing on greetings from Daniel Hooper, who interviewed him for us a couple of years ago, and he responds by telling me an elaborate tale about the two of them going on holiday to Hawaii together and it all ending in tears. Lloyd uses exactly the same tones for his tall tales and his most earnest political points. I pity any interviewer who gets into an argument with him.
Back at the time of that last interview, Troma had just released a new film, Poultrygeist, about fast food an undead chickens. I start by asking how it has fared.
"Very well," he tells me, seeming almost reluctant to come back to the subject of his work. "There are now box sets that you can get and we're working on the blu ray release. It showed at quite a few movie theatres all across the 'States and, well, I was pleased with it, because I really like that film. I think it might be the best film I've made."
After a brief pause occasioned by his mobile phone beeping, for which he makes profuse apologies, I ask about another of his films, Tromeo And Juliet. There's renewed interest in it at the moment because of a new film that's coming out in the UK, Romeo & Juliet Vs. The Living Dead, by Ryan Denmark.
"Is his film in iambic pentameter as mine is?" Lloyd asks.
I nod. "I think most of it is."
"Most of it. Hmm. My whole film was in iambic pentameter." But he's positive about it. "Anything that will call attention to Shakespeare is a good thing, I think. I'm working on The Toxic Avenger part five and I'm trying to figure out the direction I want to go in with it. I've been toying with The Boys From Syracuse, otherwise known as The Comedy Of Errors, but I don't know yet. I do love Shakespeare. I think Shakespeare would love Tromeo And Juliet. It's a good film."
"It's in the spirit of Shakespeare," I agree, having always disapproved of the sanitisation of the bard's work.
"It sure is. Shakespeare was a major shit disturber and Tromeo And Juliet uses love as a subversive theme the same way Shakespeare used it."
Lloyd is clearly looking forward to the return of Toxie, who remains a firm favourite among fans, but he's also working on several other projects. The last time we spoke to him he'd just taken up a new position with the Independent Film and Television Alliance, so I ask him how that's working out.
"I've been chairman for the past two years," he muses. "I honestly didn't think I'd get it, but you have to try with these things. I was voted in based on a platform of fighting industry consolidation because basically the media industry now controls far too much of the media and the public is not well served, so we have been using some of our resources to lobby in Washington to try to bring back some of the regulations which require the television networks to show a certain amount of independent movies. This doesn't just affect American movies but British, French and Asian movies too. About half of our members are non-American and none of us can get our movies shown on TV without either going through the vassals of the major conglomerates or getting terrible, terrible, terrible comparative prices. We're also fighting to preserve net neutrality. The internet is under assault - the big telephone companies and the major conglomerates like Sony and Rupert Murdoch don't want the internet to be a democratic medium, they don't want the internet to be diverse, they want the internet to be the empire and plaything of the white male elites."
Alongside this, of course, there is the Tromadance film festival, one of the most important showcases for truly independent film. How has that been doing?
"I wouldn't say it's going strong," he shrugs, "but Tromadance is going into its 11th year and we've been very fortunate to be able to keep a free film festival that takes place at the same time and in the same place as Sundance but with no revenue. I'm happy to report that this is now the sixth year of Tromadance New Mexico and the third year of Tromadance Indiana, and there have been Tromadances in other states. There were three years of Tromanale in Berlin, although that has ceased now. There was a TromaFling here in Edinburgh for a couple of years - maybe that'll come back. Other than the Tromadance that takes place during Sundance, all of them are put together by fans. There have also been some Tromapaloozas, which are concerts - we just had one in New Jersey."
I nod - I heard about that, and that there had been a special guest appearance by the Toxic Avenger.
"Yes, Toxie was there, and we had some great bands and we raised some money for Tromadance. Again it's a fan-run thing but I'll go if I can and I was at the one in New Jersey. There have been five years of them in Las Vegas. The fans are instrumental in making it all work, and in contributing, which you can do on the Troma site. We couldn't do what we do without the fans. We get people who go to great lengths so that they can come and work on our films for free and make things happen. I wrote a book called Make Your Own Damn Movie and people get involved because that's how they want to do things, that's what independent filmmaking should be about."
So is it harder, as some other directors and producers are saying, to make independent films in the current economic climate?
"The hardest part is getting the films to the public," he says definitively. "Poultrygeist has been distributed nowhere outside the United States and only there because Troma distributes it. It won't get on television because there's economic blacklisting. The major conglomerates have won the war with television. The internet is the last democratic medium and if the phone companies and Rupert Murdoch's cronies get rid of net neutrality then we will suffer, because we won't be getting independent art or news or commerce on the internet as we're getting now."
It's a common lament, but Lloyd isn't the sort of person to be satisfied with complaining - he prefers to take action. What can Eye For Film readers do if they want to join the fight?
"I think they have to make sure that their elected representatives keep the internet free and clear. In the UK you have a much better system because your TV does require a certain number of independent movies and home made movies and foreign films. In the 'States it's basically, well, Rupert Murdoch and Sony and Disney own pretty much everything."
The discussion is getting a little bleak, so I turn to a more light-hearted subject - George Bush. I've heard that Lloyd recently made a film with him in it, though it's not really the same sort of thing as his usual projects.
"My class at Yale asked me to bring a movie crew to our union because there was a famous minister who was going to be speaking there, and he was actually dying, so they guilted me into filming his speech," he explains. "But then, since we were also invited down to the White House - Bush was in my class - I figured I'd make a little movie out of it and film Bush and the Reverend William Sloane Coffin and mix it together and also get some of my classmates - who are now older - and film some of them talking about the Sixties. So I made it for them, for free, and I donated it to the university. It's called Splendor And Wisdom and it's really quite inspiring. Revered Sloane Coffin was the chaplain at Yale for a generation, and he was a very brave fighter for civil rights and against the Vietnam War. I believe he was indicted for encouraging students to burn their draft cards and things like that. He was a great man and the speech he made was very inspiring. If John Kerry had had the Reverend Sloane Coffin writing his speeches he would have beaten Bush in the election."
With this, alas, it's time to go, but not before Lloyd has loaded me with DVDs, posters and stickers. "It's a strange world we live in," he says, but he's still optimistic. "We've got to keep on fighting. And we've got to keep the idea out there that making a movie is something anyone can get out there and do."
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